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Post by winzor @ Porto on Jul 22, 2012 11:15:06 GMT
lets think outside the box. Hearts with a 35,000 stadium - division 3 would make them only get 5,000 of their fans come on!!!!!!!! the attendances is just an added thing to the team. the teams with big stadiums have obviously paid big to get them big in the long run, so why should it matter what league they are in? ticket prices are lower as you go down the leagues anyway. i am not sure why attendances has now become a problem to some Think you've missed my point, what I'm saying is Elite = 150,000 max fans Div 1 = 135,000 Div 2 = 120,000 Div 3 = 105,000 Then it goes on performance, hope that's clearer ohhhh, now i see what you meant yeh that is a fair enough way to do it. not many clubs will even have over that in the lower leagues anyway so would not effect too much
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Post by johnraggett on Jul 22, 2012 12:51:48 GMT
After reading what we have so far I would: Scrap T in favour of nil points nil abs Scrap play offs Cap keepers at 39 skill Open draw for fa cup
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2012 17:53:12 GMT
Keepers don't need to be capped, as someone has already mentioned, we could all end up with a 40 rated keeper. Plus some teams could have a 40 rated keeper for up to 8+ extra seasons, unrealistic.
This is going to be very unpopular but I think keepers should be aged.
Cech retiring at 42 rated is fair enough, but think all keepers should be aged accordingly!
Every keeper is different, so change each keeper individually. Look at there age and skill and work out what there potential is? A keeper can gain anywhere from 700-1200 abs per season (feel free to number crunch) so if you have a keeper who is 23yrs and 32 rated. He has 14 seasons left in the game, so working on the average of 1 skill point a season could be 46rated (potentially) So using Cech to set the bar (42rated) the keeper needs to be aged 4 years so his potential is 42. Any keeper who has a potential less than 42 leave them as they are.
This way all keepers are in line with the rest, some may fall short of there potential and some slightly over but nothing too drastic, plus forwards wouldn't gain any extra due to a decrease in skill as some have suggested.
We all have back up keepers and reserves so it ain't going to be any hardship loosing a few years on your first team keepers.
We would need to work out an average youth bonus gain for under 21's to include into the above equation though.
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Post by Malky(Admin) on Jul 22, 2012 19:34:34 GMT
im tend to agree with Andie, i'd rather age players than decrease skills
and again it would all have to be done individually, ie we would need to identify the 'problem' players and work each would out on there own! depending on what skill and age they are now!
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Post by Lee (Marseille) on Jul 22, 2012 19:40:50 GMT
Does that count for outfield players aswell
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Post by garfy on Jul 22, 2012 19:53:43 GMT
Still not understanding why a cap is a problem? nor what the problem is with teams all having the same skill keeper?
In fact we never will. The reserve is capped at 27 and if main is capped at 40 then most keepers will actually be always between 27 and 40 as we will be developing the next keeper - or have done a deal to sign one from another team....... perhaps if we also banned loans and transfers for any capped main skill players...... just thinking out loud
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Post by Malky(Admin) on Jul 22, 2012 20:32:48 GMT
I'm happy with a 40 skill cap, people are worried we will have loads of skill40 keepers, but as I see it I think there would only be a few at a time and hopefully with the ages they will retire staggered! Guys we could talk about this subject for months, there might not be any real solution that's does work perfect, I think its an area that will always need monitored
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Post by Lee (Marseille) on Jul 22, 2012 20:38:31 GMT
Why not set the cap to what Cech will be eos then think its fair for everyone
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Post by johnraggett on Jul 23, 2012 7:31:36 GMT
What about reducing the keepers retirement age, why should it be higher than another position?
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Post by bigdan on Jul 23, 2012 8:03:30 GMT
What about reducing the keepers retirement age, why should it be higher than another position? Just for realism I think. A veteran keeper continuing into his late 30s is a nice image from real life. Little bits of realism help the feel of the game I think. Following Andie's logic, if you say the average keeper abs is 1000 per season, and you want max skill to be 40 at age 37, you could just say that the max keeper skill is age+3. You could implement this either by re-rating the younger keepers down in line with their age, or by ageing them in line with their skill. This would need good compensation I think. This suggestion would totally screw Marseille and Newcastle, and be pretty hard on Aberdeen and others as well.
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Post by winzor @ Porto on Jul 23, 2012 9:07:01 GMT
wish my keepers could get close to 1 stat a season........................ 460 abs my keeper gained this season and 450 abs for the keeper i loaned out
thats half a stat, so if we go on the fact they gain 1 stat a season, i am more than half away from that. and getting seriously shafted. pretty sure i am not the only 1 gaining that (as proven by 1 of my keepers being loaned to a different team)
the season before they got 771 and 634 abs.
the season before that just my 1 keeper and he got 818 (had a good season and still not 1 stat increase)
as for my youth keeper, yeh he gets over a stat a season........... but only thanks to the bonus, when he hits 22yr old after next season and should be 27rtd.................. he will defo not gain a stat a season as not good enough to play really and will most likely gain next to nothing for several seasons at with a low rating.
i dont see how it is fair to punish keepers who have no chance of being anywhere near as good as these super keepers anyway, and when they do get close they will be near retirement.
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Post by bigdan on Jul 23, 2012 9:35:23 GMT
Yes maybe 1 skill per age is not the right formula. I just checked and my keeper "earned" even less than yours, only 355 abs. He did get 1300 youth bonus as well, but that won't be happening again. While Andie's keeper (on loan I should mention) has put on 878 abs.
Maybe it would be in my interests to drop down to Div 2 after all...
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Post by winzor @ Porto on Jul 23, 2012 9:41:24 GMT
Yes maybe 1 skill per age is not the right formula. I just checked and my keeper "earned" even less than yours, only 355 abs. He did get 1300 youth bonus as well, but that won't be happening again. While Andie's keeper (on loan I should mention) has put on 878 abs. Maybe it would be in my interests to drop down to Div 2 after all... my youth only just about made 1 stat increase for the season bud. 425 abs gained and bonus of 810 abs. 1 more season of that, and he should be close to 27rtd and no more bonuses to come :/
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Post by Malky(Admin) on Jul 23, 2012 9:44:39 GMT
Just a small bit of information i wanted to look at! this list below is the top 5 players this season for stats, ie Saves, Tackles, Passes, Shots! and what abs they have increased since the end of last season, i picked the top 5 as these guys would have picked up the most abs since last season, the rest well they must be lower, it does show what you would expect, the best just get better! and it maybe shows that keepers are fine now, defenders look ok to me only one of the top 5 have gained over 1000 abs this season midfielders only R_Tabata and Preedy have gained over 1000 abs this season and im sure both featured in the end of season awards last season forwards, only C_Pizarro stands out as getting loads, but again would have been awarded around 600/700 abs end of last season for his efforts, if anything forwards need adjusted up to bring them into line with defenders and midfielders again with keepers, Cech id expect to see being the highest as he was hard to get by and saved the most, the others have averaged about 840 which isnt bad for a season, you would expect that obviously the weaker teams that concede more wont get as many abs but thats just football is it not? C_Schulz - Inter Milan - 897 M_Nelson - Inter Milan - 787 G_Bale - Barcelona - 1110 R_Chimbonda - Inter Milan - 497 J_Martinez - Real Madrid - 782
R_Tabata - Santos FC - 1331 Xavi - Inter Milan - 867 Preety - Real Madrid - 1399 T_Gravesen - Bayern Munich - 1037 Joaquín - Barcelona - 773
C_Pizarro - Bayern Munich - 1565 R_v_Nistelroy - Inter Milan - 586 J_T_Gavilán - Real Madrid - 368 Pele - Barcelona - 451 Tone - Inter Milan - 424
P_Cech - Bayern Munich - 1520 K_Jensen - Santos FC - 1231 R_Green - Inter Milan - 646 A_Julian - Real Madrid - 691 Silvio_Proto - Barcelona - 795
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Post by bigdan on Jul 23, 2012 9:45:22 GMT
We can assume that both Aberdeen and Porto are below average on this season's performance. So maybe the average is about 750 abs per season. Then the formula gets more complicated:
sk = 0.75*age + 12.25
OR
age = 1.333*sk - 16.333
[sorry posted that before I saw Malky's stats. But you can apply any number to the formula, you just need to agree what is the average.]
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