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Post by andieglen on Sept 5, 2021 12:53:59 GMT
3. Training Academies - changed to Youth Academies - we need to get back to finding and creating youth talent, the youth academy needs to have purpose, so we revamp the scout system, our scouts don't find first team players that's your job, our scouts find youth, so our scout missions be it level 0 = 3 scouts or level 4 = 7 scouts can only be used to scout age range 17-21 our level of youth academy will still give us an end of season bonus or x5 x9 x11 x13 and x15 depending if you have a level 0-4 but this will bring back managers dealing with each other for first team players and the money will filter through the divisions again enabling 'smaller' clubs to invest in bigger academies and stadium increases, we need the money to stay in the game rather than most going out via expensive first team player purchases now within this 17-21 age rage it will still be random to which you can expect Totally agree
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Post by andieglen on Sept 5, 2021 13:24:27 GMT
5. skill caps - Keepers remain at 39 and Forwards are added to this list at skill 40, defenders and midfielders to carry on for now as not seeing the same influence in results as the other two positions Not sure about this one if honest? after this season no forward will be 40 rated so the cap will not be needed for now, however when it is needed! believe it or not you might have to take the GK cap off?? will discuss this one later lol
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Post by pezza @ Marseille on Sept 5, 2021 18:34:48 GMT
Agree with most of what malky has suggested
Just around scouting, is it not worth reducing the allowed scout to the normal 3 for Senior and then the additional youth academy ones to youth only?
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Post by pom on Sept 6, 2021 8:27:24 GMT
Name Team Age Nat St Tk Ps Sh Ag KAb TAb PAb SAb T_O_Conner 22 eng 32 3 3 2 13 752 700 700 700 M_Balfor 21 sco 32 1 1 2 32 199 500 500 500 T_Macedo 21 eng 31 3 3 3 42 852 400 400 400 P_Gazzaniga 22 arg 31 1 2 3 40 276 800 800 800 P_Assure 20 sco 31 1 1 3 40 459 500 500 500 Mark_Robinson 21 eng 1 32 10 5 23 800 751 356 681 Bohte_Daisuke 21 jap 1 32 10 5 31 700 695 737 934 M_Rose Osasuna 21 eng 1 31 8 8 31 500 776 957 606 C_Irvine 21 usa 2 31 10 7 33 600 50 771 984 N_Chalobah 23 eng 2 8 31 5 24 500 1 753 202 Leda_Cygnus 23 jap 1 9 29 19 22 700 519 690 568 Bovan 20 isr 3 10 29 13 43 500 224 739 91 Luis_Figo 21 por 1 5 28 7 33 300 615 786 521 Aparichit 20 civ 3 5 28 17 12 700 295 941 416 K_Mbappe 22 fra 2 8 7 36 12 600 333 994 744 Thanatos 22 gre 3 9 5 34 22 800 598 589 893 Taliyah 22 eng 2 7 8 32 11 500 90 361 863 S_Bergwijn 21 hol 3 10 8 31 10 600 77 88 9 N_Anelka 23 fra 2 4 11 31 21 600 920 686 541 P_B_E_Dybala 20 arg 2 6 9 30 22 500 835 165 452 J_Cummings 24 sco 3 5 9 30 32 300 671 180 837 I_Sarr 20 sen 1 9 8 30 21 600 142 89 621 A_Anderson 19 can 3 6 10 30 22 400 858 388 301 L_Griffiths 24 sco 2 10 5 29 31 500 225 142 466 J_Willock 20 eng 2 10 8 29 23 600 301 383 336 H_Sanchez 22 mex 2 6 6 29 31 300 467 887 348 E_Collamarini 20 ita 1 5 9 29 31 700 779 479 61 D_Suker Everton 24 cro 1 6 12 28 31 300 711 652 809 A_Gray Schalke 22 eng 3 7 9 28 32 600 236 769 806 L_Riva 21 ita 1 10 6 27 42 800 317 312 950 Erling_Haland 21 nor 3 7 9 27 12 500 987 461 649 If we are going back to youth scouts and all these players are left as they are - then these players will be the immortals (never get sold) and will take 15 odd seasons for them to leave the game So all the clubs who don't have a superstar will never catch up for a whole generation of players cuz there will be a 3 skill gap for youths & 40 odd superstars at 40 skill etc: I cannot see this being fair to all clubs involved in the game If it is going to be a youth scouting system these players cannot exist as they are - for the good of the game (again too much of a shift in the balance of the game) I haven't got a solution and can see the counter argument of managers investing in these players - but other managers were investing in older higher skilled players to counter the young superstars coming through (just a different management approach - yet this option will be taken away) So before everyone says what a good idea going back to how it was - there are major problems which need to be addressed Do these superstars need skill decreases etc: - these are the hard decisions needed
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Post by Andy @ schalke on Sept 6, 2021 9:00:03 GMT
I agree with this, that's kind of what i was getting at too it over corrects for the academies not having the effect the investment in them deserved by making them the only option. Likely still need to be able to scout first teamers. Could cap what level of first teamer u can scout 🤷♂️ so the youths will always be the way to the top end players? Spit balling now.
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Post by pezza @ Marseille on Sept 6, 2021 9:01:23 GMT
No, of course these players dont need to be decreased, thats what the skill limits are being introduced for, this limits their growth but still allows the managers who have taken time, and sacrificed results by developing these players to keep what they have and don't forget people have been spending real life money on those skills that you now want to take away.
Personally i think its a massive backward step to reduce the ab to donation ratio back to 3, this will make youths totally pointless again which is the opposite of what we are trying to do but if thats what Malky wants to do then so be it, its not hurting the managers who have developed a certain way.
I do agree with the senior scouts issue though, maybe this could be introduced slowly, so reduce the senior scouts from 3, to 2 to 1 and then zero over the next few seasons to give teams time to plan and switch strategies.
But reducing players in anyway - absolutely not, this only benefits those who have ignored youths and got short term success out of it - what does that say to those of us who have sacrificed to develop those players?
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Post by pom on Sept 6, 2021 9:42:27 GMT
No, of course these players dont need to be decreased, thats what the skill limits are being introduced for, this limits their growth but still allows the managers who have taken time, and sacrificed results by developing these players to keep what they have and don't forget people have been spending real life money on those skills that you now want to take away. Personally i think its a massive backward step to reduce the ab to donation ratio back to 3, this will make youths totally pointless again which is the opposite of what we are trying to do but if thats what Malky wants to do then so be it, its not hurting the managers who have developed a certain way. I do agree with the senior scouts issue though, maybe this could be introduced slowly, so reduce the senior scouts from 3, to 2 to 1 and then zero over the next few seasons to give teams time to plan and switch strategies. But reducing players in anyway - absolutely not, this only benefits those who have ignored youths and got short term success out of it - what does that say to those of us who have sacrificed to develop those players? The skill limits are there to stop the game being ruined in the future - nothing to do with this problem What does it say to managers who have sacrificed youth for older players with a quicker rotation of players due to retirement - paying out massively $$$ for these players - different management skills due to the rules at the time Getting rid of older scouts is a way of reintroducing money and transfers back in the game - nothing to do with monster youth players
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Post by pezza @ Marseille on Sept 6, 2021 14:30:46 GMT
Skill limits are being introduced specifically to stop the growth of these super youth players...that solves the problem. Why shouldnt Barcelona enjoy a 40 rated striker for 10 seasons plus when theyve put in the work to get him there.
I actually agree with you on the older player scouts and i think they should remain in some capacity, even if its only for a couple more seasons to allow managers to plan accordingly, but when we skill caps are introduced and the capacity to donate on those players is removed, i see no justification for introducing a third punishment and reducing the skills of these players who arent even the best on the game yet!
Nice to have a reasonable discussion about it though even if we still can't agree on anything!
Well done on your title though, superb management throughout the season.
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Post by Dillon (OSA) on Sept 6, 2021 17:32:06 GMT
No, of course these players dont need to be decreased, thats what the skill limits are being introduced for, this limits their growth but still allows the managers who have taken time, and sacrificed results by developing these players to keep what they have and don't forget people have been spending real life money on those skills that you now want to take away. Personally i think its a massive backward step to reduce the ab to donation ratio back to 3, this will make youths totally pointless again which is the opposite of what we are trying to do but if thats what Malky wants to do then so be it, its not hurting the managers who have developed a certain way. I do agree with the senior scouts issue though, maybe this could be introduced slowly, so reduce the senior scouts from 3, to 2 to 1 and then zero over the next few seasons to give teams time to plan and switch strategies. But reducing players in anyway - absolutely not, this only benefits those who have ignored youths and got short term success out of it - what does that say to those of us who have sacrificed to develop those players? The skill limits are there to stop the game being ruined in the future - nothing to do with this problem What does it say to managers who have sacrificed youth for older players with a quicker rotation of players due to retirement - paying out massively $$$ for these players - different management skills due to the rules at the time Getting rid of older scouts is a way of reintroducing money and transfers back in the game - nothing to do with monster youth players100% this, the market has died a rapid death ever since first team scouts were introduced into the game, money goes out the game at a rate we've never seen before. Most teams spend the entire budget on 1 player and settle their window there. Managers need to be able to wheel and deal to keep the game active and healthy, and it needs to be a viable route for smaller clubs to make progress. I don't think it's going to be fair to slowly reduce scouts either, given that the same time window wasn't given to anyone else for any other major change in the game. Donation ratio back to 3 is absolutely fine as it's going to stop a huge problem in more monster youths. The clubs that have developed monster youths are still getting fantastic players out of it. Decreasing them is probably for the best in terms of the game's health and balance but it's an impossible question finding out how to properly compensate the managers that developed them given real money was spent and a lot of sacrifices made for these players, Rose for example cost me 105m (and 2 or 3 seasons of donations) just due to the speculation on where he could get to! No one will ever agree on what compensation would be fair, everyone will want different stuff. It's not going to be like it was with Lloris where we had to appease 1 manager with a deal to get a player out of the game, you're talking about appeasing 4/5/6 managers over 20-30 players which is going to be an absolute nightmare trying to fix.
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Post by bruffio on Sept 7, 2021 13:26:20 GMT
i said i was not going to comment again as ive had my say BUT i had 4 players on that list and if you add my youth keeper who will be 20 years old and 32 rated that makes five and if they are taken out of the game id call time, not only would that cripple my team as all five are starters for me now next season but i can not think of a compensation that make me agree to and not feel like im getting rogered up tha jacksie, just too much time put into these guys
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Post by pom on Sept 8, 2021 10:13:20 GMT
i said i was not going to comment again as ive had my say BUT i had 4 players on that list and if you add my youth keeper who will be 20 years old and 32 rated that makes five and if they are taken out of the game id call time, not only would that cripple my team as all five are starters for me now next season but i can not think of a compensation that make me agree to and not feel like im getting rogered up tha jacksie, just too much time put into these guys FFS Bruffio - you think you put time in players !!!! How many seasons do you think we put in building players up "with all the old restrictive rules" (not just 5 odd seasons of free for all) Just look at Odegaard, Bojan, Ivica_Strok - in the player database against the superstars These players are 27,28,29 years old now - and all 31 skill FWDS (these were the best youths of the day ) Now all these players were recruited at 17 years old (in the old rules) - so thats basically 10-12 seasons ago Don't tell me what sacrifices had to be made over 10-12 seasons to progress these players and also stay competitive Bar - McGowan - Neymar etc all came from the old rules - but the above 3 were always understudy's and by rights should be now becoming the top FWDS but NO cuz theres a bunch of superstars who appeared within 5 seasons of entering the game and totally obliterated them in skills ... I've put so much time in loads of players and have rightly been rogered numerous times due to rule changes (Have pleaded with Malky not to introduce certain rules on numerous occasions throughout the last 30 seasons - which I am sure he will attest to) All because I envisaged where the game would head - oh and guess what here we are !!!!
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Post by Malky(Admin) on Sept 8, 2021 10:38:57 GMT
it might be an idea to still allow scout missions on players aged 31+ will a random factor +-3 skill either side of age meaning older players can still be bought but we know there impact on the game will be minimal due to them only potentially having a small number of seasons to play before retiring, so we could let everyone have there normal 3 scouts on 17-21 and 31+ age group only and clubs with 4-7 scouts more must use these on 17-21 age group?
at least then we can still have the option of recruiting first team players ie keeper
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Post by pom on Sept 8, 2021 10:54:13 GMT
it might be an idea to still allow scout missions on players aged 31+ will a random factor +-3 skill either side of age meaning older players can still be bought but we know there impact on the game will be minimal due to them only potentially having a small number of seasons to play before retiring, so we could let everyone have there normal 3 scouts on 17-21 and 31+ age group only and clubs with 4-7 scouts more must use these on 17-21 age group? at least then we can still have the option of recruiting first team players ie keeper S H I T E option TBF (i've actually never scouted a 31+ outfield player ever ) If the superstars are staying as they are - you cant just stop older scouts I never knew why we changed from the older version of scouts - the ones who didn't have the double skills unless you wanted a DM or AM The new scouts came out of the blue cuz Malky was influenced by other games as i see it ... Don't think anyone wanted the new scouts at all - but it was rushed And Bruff wouldn't go saying "i'd call time" cuz look what happened to Bryn when a rule was introduced to newer managers and experienced managers were left in the dark !!!! (It's not always been a level playing field)
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Post by bruffio on Sept 8, 2021 14:44:46 GMT
as usual you missed my point Pom if you looked at my squad you'd know why id be pissed i have 4 starters retiring and if you take the 5 others out of my squad id be going into elite division with 2 starters man city would be fooked , dead in the water. when you make big changes like you seem to want you got make sure no one gets buried and as ive said before i may opine but ill go with whatever id probably look a new team or ask for city to be removed but all i ever want is a game i enjoy AND just for all you, none of these super youths at nay of the clubs where or are illegal they where created within the ruleset of the game
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Post by pezza @ Marseille on Sept 8, 2021 15:31:01 GMT
As has been pointed out by a few people, its impossible to remove or remove skills from these players that people have put real money and alot of time into, the solution to these has already been suggested, a skill cap to make sure they dont ever get out of hand.
A rule change has been bought in to stop these players been created again, personally i dont agree with the 10 skill limit being removed but it does solve the issue of future players so it does a job i guess.
Scout changes being bought in to help reignite the transfer market - again i can see this will do the job but i would like a more measured approach, like 3 scouts for seniors and then any additional being youth only - but again i can accept whatever is bought in as it is an equal playing field for all.
Every team on the game has the option to develop youth players over the last 5 to 6 seasons, you cant punish the few who decided to do just that.
It doesn't come off very well when the person suggesting it is at the top of the league, with none of these players, that could see his team overtaken - stinks of self preservation for not taking the time to develop these players and just enjoying the short term success of older players. I'm sure Pom will deny it and say its just in the best interests of the game, but i'd suggest its in the best interests of his team more than any other in the game to try to penalise those teams who have superstars growing that will overtake his players over the next few seasons.
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